Austrian Legends. Folk Tales and Oral Traditions. A Glimpse Into The Past.

Silvanus777

Well-known member
Messages
61
Likes
367
#1
In my homecountry of Austria, we have a rich tradition of folk tales and legends that were, for the longest time, orally transmitted. Sadly, fewer and fewer people are paying know of or pay attention to them. Of course, we are all expected to see these as nothing more than silly old people’s tales, empty superstitions and basically only slightly over actual fairy tales (like the Brothers Grimm ones) when it comes to the percentage of truth that is said to be contained in them.

I wish to share some of the more interesting legends and old folk’s sayings that could have a bearing on our quest for unraveling a different, lost past or history. But first, please allow me to reflect a bit on the question why I find folk tales such a promising source for gathering authentic information about the past:

Except for maybe ethnologists and students of folklore, academia holds these orally transmitted sayings of our ancestors in disregard. Nobody would think of, or dare to think of even, using traditional legends, folk tales and sayings as a valid source for drawing conclusions about or gaining a better picture of our history. As you can imagine, I beg to differ on the matter. For me, these legends may very well contain more truth than one might expect, and I am of the firm opinion that oral tradition could reflect the true nature and course of history and historic events far more accurately than anything we get handed down from academia with its dogmatic orthodoxy.

Just think about it: Stories told and retold from generation to generation, in absence of distractions like TV or smartphone, cannot be centrally controlled or steered, are deeply “democratic” or “grassroots” for lack of better terms, and agenda-free. The downside of course is that they represent at least to a degree a game of telephone. Without doubt, they were constantly re-interpreted to fit new living realities throughout the generation and were suspect to the cultural influences of the time.

In the case of the Austrian folk legends, one encounters the too-be-expected superstitious coloring, and the strongest, christitan religious (specifically Roman Catholic) tint, or should I say, spin, on basically everything that is going on in majority of these stories. It’s similar to the folk tales of other traditionally catholic regions I guess. Basically the devil and his demons serve as an explanatory device for every mystifying or adverse occurrence, with “Mother of God” catholic Mary and saints being the counterpart responsible for beneficial things. I think, however, one can remove these layers and veils, which from just reading the text appear as quite obvious later additions or twists, and get to the core of the matter. “Peeling away truth’s protective layers” (as N. Armstrong recommends in an unrelated case ;-) ) can enable an open minded explorer of these texts dealing with oral traditions to gather vital clues of some hidden and lost “old world”.

And now to the main show.
Here's some of our Austrian legends that might be of interest to you.
Quick note on the Sources: The information comes mostly from the 1932 “Öberösterreichisches Sagenbuch” (Upper Austrian Book of Folk Legends) by A. Depiny. The information is not presented in single stories like "Snow White and the Seven Dwarves" or similar fairy tale stories, but rather as a huge collection of anecdotes, that have been widespread among the Upper Austrian countryfolk, including some longer, more detailed accounts.

1. Families of giants as castle & church builders
The building of many (now ruined) castles and even churches is often attributed to giants in our local legends. According to these, giants were hired / employed in bringing the heavy stone blocks from nearby quarries and stacking them up on site. The church in the town of Taufkirchen in my area is said to have been built by them, and the gargantuan builders are even said to lay buried underneath it. Well not anymore after some centuries of heavy Jesuit presence and power…

In any case, the fact that these giants were seemingly remembered as very real people (or creatures?) is impressively illustrated in one particular anecdote, which I feel compelled to share in full:

“On the mountain rising above St. Konrad once lived the dynasty of the Rüepel (“Ruffians”). Of their dwellings no trace remains, however clearly one can still observe their (agricultural) fields, the Rüepel-acres on the Brandstätter mountain. On the wavy Wirtsberg mountain lies the Rüepel-graveyard. The Rüepels had their own roads, one leading up into the high forest towards Grünau, one to the south towards the Traunsee lake, One of these roads lead straight through the Holzinger family farmhouse… Their church stood near the Rüepel-acres – it had once sunken and disappeared into the ground along with a merry wedding company and nowadays there is a pond in that spot.”

St. Konrad.jpg

View of St. Konrad - I think the mountain in the background is the one mentioned in the story.

I find accounts like this incredibly fascinating, and it is not just one of a kind. In Tyrole they know of the savage "Löda" family of giants in a similar vein, and so on.
I really don't think the olden people would describe some purely fictional, larger than life, mythological creatures like in the above story. Now I have to say I never visited the area where these giants had supposedly lived. If I had money and power, I’d chance an excavation of this legendary giant graveyard, LOL!

(Note the sunken into the ground church of the giants!!)

2. The Wild Hunt
The Wild Hunt or the Wild Hunter and his company, as it is sometimes called, are a mysterious phenomenon of the olden days that puzzles many people fond of folklore and the past here greatly. It was described as an airborne, ghostly company of demonic riders accompanied by all kinds of ghastly animals and monsters that stormed with lightning & thundering, screaming and loud noise over the countryside in full moon nights or at special times of the year (between winter solstice and new years).

Wilde Jagd small.jpg

Fanciful artist's interpretation of the Wild Hunt. It got popularly mixed-up with the "Ride of the Valkyries" image, as popularized by Richard Wagner.

The Wild Hunt seemed to follow some very predictable patterns in its course and behavior, that leads me to think of it as some past, misunderstood aerial / electric / electromagnetic phenomenon, and on top has some very clear parallels of this modern day UFO / alien abduction phenomenon:
  • It traveled along certain pathways, a meter or more over the ground, oftentimes high up into the air and preferably spiraling around church steeples. Curiously, the old paths of the Wild Hunt are identified as our old countryside roads, called “Hohlwege” – hollowed out ways – that are cut several meters deep into hillsides here in a V-shape, with the actual roadway on the bottom. These were considered haunted up until recently, and people shunned them.
  • The people seemingly were able to somewhat modify the prescribed course the Hunt would travel along. For example one story mentions that the building of a chapel or small church prevented the Hunt from crossing through a village it terrorized previously. The ghostly company would simply turn there an go back on the way it came from.
  • The wild hunt abducts people and certain animals. They have to fly along through the air amongst the wild company, and return the next morning under amnesia, disoriented, scratched, bruised and battered. Sometimes the people or animals are found dead at very distant locations, or not at all.
  • It can strike you dead on the spot upon touch. (Descriptions sound like death by electric shock)
  • Abovementioned dangers can be avoided by dropping to the ground and staying there flat until the phenomenon has passed. Throwing oneself into one of the cart ruts in case of being surprised by it on the read is recommended. This way, the Hunt, which passes about a foot or a meter above the ground can’t hurt you.
  • Etc.
It’s really fascinating to me how all the accounts of encounters with the Wild Hunt paint a very clear picture of a natural phenomenon, rather than some wild, superstitious devil and demon, spiritual thing. I am thinking about something of electromagnetic nature, although it might be more unconventional than that (I know nothing about ether physics LOL). Electricity seems to have played an important part though. It really makes me think if this had something to do with this often theorized ancient energy grid? As an out-of-control discharge of a failing or gradually being demolished aerial electricity transmission grid maybe? With a brilliant crowd like you I don’t think I need to spell all the thouhgts that could come to mind when reading about the Wild Hunt's behavior above! :D;)

My closing note on the phenomenon though: Whatever it was, it has completely stopped and I know no reports of something similar to it within at least the last 100 years. Not even the slight haunting here or there! Ancient energy grid 100% out-of-order over here it seems! ;-)

3. Deluge Stories
In Upper Austria especially, we have many smaller and larger lakes. There is a cluster of them, the Upper Austrian Lake Country on the northern edge of the Austrian Alps.

Salzkammergut Lakes small.jpg

The "Salzkammergut", Upper Austrian Lake Country. South is up, north is down.

Now a plethora of deluge legends happens to exist in that area, each explaining the origin of one or another of these lakes in a very similar, interesting manner:

Once upon a time there was a fertile and lush valley, populated with towns of rich and happy people. But then there was a wicked knight, count or baron (or wizard in some of the stories) ruling over the valley who sinned gravely all the time. One time he overdid it, and God sent heavy thunderstorms while simultaneously the ground cracked open and released huge amounts of water, which flooded the whole valley. Thus, the lake was formed. Commonly, in these stories one could see the top of the church spire (or the cross thereon) or the highest castle battlements still beneath the waves for a long time afterwards, if the water was clear. Howling and moaning of the ghosts of the dead sinners – alternatively the laughing of the revelers – was heard during full moon nights. The art of embellishment in storytelling, y’know! ;)

In general, legends of places getting flooded or destroyed by water are commonplace all over Austria, not only where the lakes are. And from the way these stories are told, they don’t seem to be taking place in some far distant antiquity or primitive times. They sound as if written the period of feudalism, with knights and counts as feudal lord and their subservient peasantry. I can’t tell if the stories may have morphed and if the way the world is described in them can be taken as accurate. As they stand however, the local flood legends would indeed support a 15th century (or so) cataclysm in Europe involving flooding.

Disclaimer: It has to be duely noted, that all this could very well just be naive folkloristic adaptations and localizations of the biblical flood story as preached in church.

4. Dwarfs really just short Italian/Venetian guys?
Quoting directly from A. Depiny's "Upper Austrian Book of Folk Legends":

“Chapter 7: The Short Welshmen:

In times gone by, Italians came to the Alps, spent weeks in the mountains, collected mysterious rocks and returned to the South laden with bags. Up to the 18th century these treasure seekers were seen…”

The term “dwarfs” in Austrian legends was often used synonymously with what could be translated to English as “short Venetian men”, “short Welshmen” or even simply “the Welsh”. Don’t confuse it with today’s English language understanding of “the Welsh”. In the olden days in Germans lands it was Italians, and even ancient Romans, who were called Welsh(men)”. The 1493 (?) “Nuremberg Chronicle” calls Italy “Welshland” and Italians “Welsh”. (What a confusing way of recording history!)

venedigermandl.jpg

Modern mural of a "Venediger Mandl" (Short Welshman) on a mountainside home. Note the flag of Venice on the coat.

These visitations of “short Venetian men”, coming as secretive and stealthy prospectors looking for precious metals and gems in the Austrian alpine mountains looks to have been a very real, very common occurrence. They stayed with locals overnight and paid them with gems and gold. There are many stories about the seemingly magical powers of these very real, short Italians. One is said to have opened up a gateway in a rockface by reading from a book and a “colleage” appeared from inside the cliff handing over bags of gold. Another Short Welshman did the same trick with a strange rod. In general there are various account of these dwarfish men having rods that could either open up hidden passages in the rock or find gold. Sounds almost like a detector of sorts.

Although these short statured strangers from Italy are basically the Austrian version of a dwarf, they seemed to be just real people, nothing magical about them. In one story a lumberjack even meets one of them he had previously showed around in the mountains, just living in a regular city house in the Upper Austrian capitol of Linz.

The question here becomes this:

Was there once a considerable size difference between northern Germans/Austrians and southern Italians/Venetians that would have lead my ancestors to identify the latter as “small/short” men or even as dwarfs? Where the Italians smaller in the past or the Germanics taller? Or both? Or just an old case of anti-Italian racism?? :p

5. Castles sinking into the ground
Besides the legends of castles, churches and towns being swallowed by devastating floods, we have the even more curious case of accounts of buildings spontaneously sinking into the ground, disappearing completely in the earth or so that the flagpole or crosses on the tower tops could be seen for some time after.

These stories of course have also a moralizing, Christian spin to them, as we have seen with the flood legends. Grave sin like gambling, revelry and carousing or cursing the Holy Virgin or whatever is traditionally given for the reason for castles etc. disappearing into the ground without a trace.

One of these sunken castles is said to have stood in my immediate vicinity, just a few kilometers to the west of my house. It’s a huge pit in the middle of the forest and called the “penny pit”. The story goes that a castle stood there which sank into the ground where the pit now is, and that it’s named “penny pit” either because people threw spare change in there for some superstitious reasons (throwing pennies into a fountain for luck is still a common practice her) OR that the coin treasure sunken with the castle is the reason for the name.

Anyways, I am really thrilled with having recently learned about the possibility of liquefaction due to earthquakes – and I immediately made the connection to this kinda commonplace motif in our local legends. Fascinating stuff for me!
----------
OK that does it for now. I don’t need to mention that the above bits are just the tip of the iceberg. There’s a vast wealth of similar legends and folk tales here in Austria, although I am sure an even larger part has been irretrievably lost and forgotten. Please feel free to query me if you want to know more about anything. Obviously I couldn't go in too much detail for sake of not blowing the original post any more out of proportion. ;)

Now please, you guys, if anyone knows some folk tales or legends or just old stories of similarly mysterious character, please feel free to use this thread as a place to share them! I would be thrilled to hear them, from wherever you may hail! I for one just always loved and devoured these mystery stories and legends of my homeland from a very early age on. For me, they added some spice - so to say - to the otherwise somewhat bland and mundane countryside and its history. More generally speaking, they allow us to look at times long gone by through the eyes of those that were before us, skipping the sleight of hand of the conjuring academic middleman.

I hope you enjoyed these local Austrian folk legends, and maybe even find them somewhat worhtwile in terms of info! :D
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Silvanus777

Silvanus777

Well-known member
Messages
61
Likes
367
#3
Something just occured to me:

The soil in the pit where the former castle is said to have stood (the one in my neighbourhood) consists of marl, as does a large part of the hillsides of my general area. Have a look at what marl is, if you don't know. It's rather uncommon I think, but typical for southern Germany and northwestern Austria (where I am). Where it doesn't occur in brittle, layered plates as a semi-solid sedimentary rock, it makes for a very soft and sandy material. Also common round here, maybe even where that pit is, is a very fine sand, flowing and soft-to-the-touch sand. Not sandstone. Sand, more or less compacted by the pressure of the topsoil layers.

In the light of what I have recently learned about soil liquefaction and seen videos of it in effect, the fact that marl and sand forms large parts of my local countryside makes idea that there is in fact something to that sunken castle legend ever more palpable. The pit is in fact a marl pit. Historically, marl was also quarried here as well as a fertilizer - that is the official explanation for all pits like the castle one. Now I have not tested it, but I have a hunch that shaking finely granulated marl as found in the ground round here would in fact liquefy it beautifully!

Somewhat like...

...SO:


Yah, I know prolly all of you have already seen something similar to this. Just for dramatic effect! :whistle:
 
Last edited:

Paracelsus

Well-known member
Messages
163
Likes
601
#5
The "short Venetian man" is an interesting one, especially the rod that could locate precious metals. That is far more than a fairy tale, it is a bit of an embellishment of the use of a divining/dowsing rod.

People may be familiar with the use of a Y shaped dowsing rod or two L shaped copper wires placed in both hands to locate any item (typically water sources). But there was also a technique that used a straight rod to locate precious metal deposits. Generally, the material used for the rod was of the same type of wood that grew over a gold or silver deposit. The reasoning was that the wood would have a natural affinity for that specific type of ore deposit.

How one was to use a dowsing rod was by first locating the deposit then counting how many downward dips the rod made. Generally a dip of the rod would have a corresponding depth in feet (meters for those on base 10) and would note that as the depth of the deposit.

Dowsing has a rich history in Germany, especially in Rammelsberg, and the Harz mountains. I don't know the original Deutsch, but dowsers were called "mountain-knights."

*
Here's just some pieces that I've picked up from the Indian tales of the American Southwest. Apparently, the Anasazi weren't just some historical tribe that mysteriously vanished. The Navajo called them "The Ancient Enemies," not "The Ancient Ones." They also speak of "The Crow People," people that could transform into a crow the size of a man. The "Crow People" are much like the Tengu (Forest Demons) of Japanese legend, or perhaps they are more like Skinwalkers. Here is one of my favorite warnings. If you ever find yourself near the ruins of Anasazi cliff dwellings and feel the intense urge to climb up on them, don't. It is the spirits of the Ancient Enemies luring you up there so they can throw you to your death.
*
Skinwalkers
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Silvanus777

Silvanus777

Well-known member
Messages
61
Likes
367
#6
Better get a pick ax and shovel and start investigating that pit where the castle once stood, it's probably still down there.
Better not. Any and all out of the ordinary behaviour is swiftly punished in this neck of the woods. You'd have the police along with a straightjacket squad chasing after you in like no time! :ROFLMAO:

But seriously, if people like us had the means and resources of academic archaeologists (even though they're chronically underfunded) such as ground radar or similar equipment as well as ground to stand on when talking to local authorities for permits and stuff, probing this pit and digging into it would be a promising endeavour.

@Paracelsus: Yes, dowsing is still a relatively popular practice among Austrian countryfolk, and many people vouch for its efficacy. I must admit I never took them seriously - to my shame. But I've been ignorant of many things in the past. The proper German term is "Rutengehen", literally "rod-walking". Oh how elegantly straightforward the German language is! :sneaky:
 

Onthebit

Active member
Messages
70
Likes
218
#7
When I worked construction at the nuke station we were trying to locate a water pipe with a sucker truck and shovels for @ 3-4 days to no avail. According to the blue prints it had to be somewhere around there. I took 2 welding rods and located the pipe @ 15 feet north of where we were digging. I showed my foreman who took it to the super and after much debate they allowed us to take the sucker truck over to the new site and to much disbelief the pipe was located within half hour.
 

Paracelsus

Well-known member
Messages
163
Likes
601
#8
@Silvanus777,
I know this is off topic, but one of my inventor heroes hails from your neck of the woods, Viktor Schauberger. If you ever get the chance, go check out the PKS in Bad Ischl.
Home | PKS

Schauberger even gives his theory on the phenomenon of the Niebelungen and sono-luminescence. Fairy tale tangential.
When I worked construction at the nuke station we were trying to locate a water pipe with a sucker truck and shovels for @ 3-4 days to no avail. According to the blue prints it had to be somewhere around there. I took 2 welding rods and located the pipe @ 15 feet north of where we were digging. I showed my foreman who took it to the super and after much debate they allowed us to take the sucker truck over to the new site and to much disbelief the pipe was located within half hour.
I'm still making my way through this book:
The Divining Hand : The 500-Year-Old Mystery of DowsingDowsing
The Divining Hand: The 500 Year-old Mystery of Dowsing by Christopher Bird

If there was ever a more supressed and ridiculed technology than dowsing, I don't know what it would be. Towns that lose their drinking water supply quietly bring in dowsers, pay them, and then hush up. In your case they probably just attributed your hit to luck or statistical probability.

It's all just fairy tales, right?
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
Silvanus777

Silvanus777

Well-known member
Messages
61
Likes
367
#9
Dang, I feel stupid. Thank you, kind American gentleman, helping around the Austrian in his Austrian neighborhood! Hahaha! :ROFLMAO:

I didn't even know Schauberger was born in the Mühlviertel, which is basically just across the Danube river, not for to the north of my location. Amazing! And the PKS was completely unknown to me as well. Not far off either - thank you so much for the tip.

I had heard about Schaubergers inventions first in the early 2000s, when I had somehow come across the topic of NS saucer craft... What a shame he, as well as so many other unconventional thinkers, scientists and researchers got thrown in with the Nazis to discredit them and bury their work.
Personally, I had lost lost sight of Schauberger stuff pretty much, and I only learned about him in passing as a teenager. I am really happy you brought this up, especially your mentioning of
his theory on the phenomenon of the Niebelungen and sono-luminescence.
I will have to look into that soon. Sounds intriguing! (y)
 

whitewave

Well-known member
Messages
741
Likes
1,974
#10
I believe the Untersberg mountain is around that area (says the dyslexic who gets lost going to the bathroom). I heard about that mountain years ago when I was researching the portal in Beaver, Oklahoma. Seems that mountain is also a portal with stories of "little people", lost time, many disappearances that make the news and other high strangeness.
Hitler built a house nearby and got a telescope so he could watch that mountain as he believed it held magical powers/technology that could help him win the war.
What more can you tell us about it, if anything? I'm not trying to get off into some odd tangent removed from stolen history; I'm interested in approaching history from all angles. If there is any truth to the mythos of the Untersberg mountains (and from the many newspaper clippings about disappearances there, there seems to be) then it could be a clue to "lost" technology that still exists. TIA.
 

Paracelsus

Well-known member
Messages
163
Likes
601
#11
Dang, I feel stupid. Thank you, kind American gentleman, helping around the Austrian in his Austrian neighborhood! Hahaha! :ROFLMAO:

I didn't even know Schauberger was born in the Mühlviertel, which is basically just across the Danube river, not for to the north of my location. Amazing! And the PKS was completely unknown to me as well. Not far off either - thank you so much for the tip.

I had heard about Schaubergers inventions first in the early 2000s, when I had somehow come across the topic of NS saucer craft... What a shame he, as well as so many other unconventional thinkers, scientists and researchers got thrown in with the Nazis to discredit them and bury their work.
Personally, I had lost lost sight of Schauberger stuff pretty much, and I only learned about him in passing as a teenager. I am really happy you brought this up, especially your mentioning of


I will have to look into that soon. Sounds intriguing! (y)
That Nazi "affiliation" is one of the surest ways to discredit one of the most gifted inventor's of the past century. Truly a despicable way to honor his memory.

Viktor Schauberger is a national treasure for sure - whether people know it or not - someday he will be vindicated. His work with water is some of the most profound material I've ever read. His ethos of "comprehend and copy nature" has become my own line of inquiry.
 

Ice Nine

Well-known member
Messages
395
Likes
1,551
#13
@Paracelsus kudos for mentioning Die Nibelungen, an epic tale of a lost/forgotten time, well except we have that epic saga. I actually think there could have been dragons in one of the many cycles on Earth. Something keeps happening were we forget everything. I think we have more going on than just time issues and cover-ups.

And about the wild hunt, this part got to me. I can't help myself, it sounds like alien abductions. Some sort of abduction, doesn't have to be Aliens per say, they could be terrestrial.
  • The wild hunt abducts people and certain animals. They have to fly along through the air amongst the wild company, and return the next morning under amnesia, disoriented, scratched, bruised and battered. Sometimes the people or animals are found dead at very distant locations, or not at all.
I just thought of something silly... What if we are the dwarves? If we had giants in the past they may have told stories of little people and we were the little people... And we passed on "their" stories...
OMG, just last night I said the same thing, we were watching The Hobbit Battle of the Five Armies, for the umpteethn time. And I said the same thing, it was like an epiphany, I said, we were the Dwarfs! it just all made sense. Big structures, big doorways for the normal/giant people.
 
Last edited:

Paracelsus

Well-known member
Messages
163
Likes
601
#14
@Paracelsus kudos for mentioning Die Nibelungen, an epic tale of a lost/forgotten time, well except we have that epic saga. I actually think there could have been dragons in one of the many cycles on Earth. Something keeps happening were we forget everything. I think we have more going on than just time issues and cover-ups.
It was going to nag my mind until I could find the exact quote about Das Rheingold:

"Large rivers such as the Danube, Rhine, Tagliamento, Etsch, Garonne and Mississippi bear witness to the failure of such complicated and costly river regulations. Quite apart from the tremendous damage caused in the lower reaches by their strictly mechanical regulation, these rivers are stripped of their most valuable assets, their great physical qualities. The present dirty grey, muddy brew known as the Blue Danube, upon whose bed river-gold once gleamed, and the Rhine, the symbol of German identity, where Rheingold flashed in bygone days, are tragic testimonials to these perverse practices. The mythical 'Gold of the Niebelungs' originated in the golden glow given off by pebbles as they rubbed against eachother while rolling along the riverbed at night - for when there is a decrease in water temperature, the tractive force increases, causing the stones to move. If two pebbles are rubbed together under water, a golden glow appears."
- Viktor Schauberger The Water Wizard p.16
 
OP
OP
Silvanus777

Silvanus777

Well-known member
Messages
61
Likes
367
#17
Alright, glad I inspired a healthy discussion with my write-up!

@whitewave - Regarding the Untersberg:

The Untersberg in the province of Salzburg is about two hours to the south-west by car from me. Never been there (adverse circumstances have rendered me rather immobile the last 10 years :() but it is of old the nexus of much of legendary, mythical and spooky going ons in Austria in general. Much spookiness is said to have occured there since basically forever, and the most popular folk tale motif connected to the Untersberg is the "Untersberg-Manndl" = Untersberg tiny men. They're these typical dwarf or gnome characters that are said to mine and amass heaps of gold, silver and gems in the deeps of the mountain, living unseen to the human eye in underground caverns, which they exit and enter through concealed, secret doors in rockfaces, also possessing the power of making themselves invisible - usually by the use of "Tarnkappen", that is litereally "stealth caps"

Keeping that in mind, the modern legends of the Nazis, as @whitewave alluded to, having had an underground tunnel system / secret base deep inside the Untersberg, becomes quite interesting if you bear the dwarf tunnels of olden legend in mind! Man I wished I could show you some really cheesy TV documentary from one of our cheesy Austrian TV channels where they follow nutcases around who are into mysteries n'shite: Still it has a lot of fascinating info about mysterious places in Austria, including the Untersberg. Besides the time portal or time phenomena rumors going around even among English speakers on the web, there are actually people who are looking for the Nazis in the Untersberg today, as some believe they are still there... One guy in the TV show claimed he knew someone who even met one of them when exploring caverns in the Untersberg, and reported he or they (some Nazis) were stuck in time there... Haha, that is all really wild and I'm wary of taking anything at face value, especially when shown on cheesy Austrian TV. Would love to show you the documentary. It's even on youtube, but in German alas...

Among many more legends and rumors surrounding the Untersberg, there is also this notion that Charlemagne, of all ficitional characters, is sleeping within the mountain and waiting for his soon return. You know, to be "The once and future king of the Germans" I guess. To me, clearly, just a romantic adaptation of Arthurian material. There is a whole short story around this which is populary retold in many modern Austrian folk tale books, but I really think it is rather worthless and is based on some utterly fictional, romantic short story written not too long ago. I haven't been able to trace that story to it's roots as of yet. Just had to mention "Charlemagne" sleeping in the Untersberg. Come on, why not Aragarn!? :ROFLMAO:

@Onijunbei Yes, that is kinda what I was alluding to when I wrote in the OP
Was there once a considerable size difference between northern Germans/Austrians and southern Italians/Venetians that would have lead my ancestors to identify the latter as “small/short” men or even as dwarfs? Where the Italians smaller in the past or the Germanics taller? Or both?
Your silly thoughts regarding dwarfs and giants mirror my silly thoughts, LOL. Somebody has to have been considerably larger in former times, or someone considerably smaller than today's average height in humans. Who were the dwarfs and who the giants I cannot really tell from the available material... However I have been seriously entertaining the thought that massive eu-/dysgenics programs could have been used some time prior to the photographic era to accomplish uniformity among human body types. Just thoughts, but basically a combination of genociding any and all misfits (taller, smaller, different types of humans) and mixing up the rest good, so you have the "average" human as the new norm in the end! What do you guys think bout that line of thought? As far as explaining all the old stories of giants and dwarfs/gnomes and their absence today?

@Ice Nine

Yeah, the dragons... Don't get me started. I didn't mention it cause it seems almost unexcitingly ordinary - the dragon stories. They are all over the place in Austria as well, obviously. The classical dragonslayer motif adapted to the world of the old Austrian peasantry, but more organic sounding reports too, which also make me quite a firm believer in the existence of large reptiles aka dragons in a past and lost age of humanity.

And the Wild Hunt: At this point, I have come to reject the notion of "extraterrestrials" completely. Now "extradimensionals" is a whole nother story! ;) And those would be great candidates for explaining at least part of the Wild Hunt phenomenon, as well as the plethora of other miscellaneous devil, demon and ghost haunting stories going around not only in Austria. The prize question for me here is always why we don't witness these things on such a mass scale today anymore? And I mean the Austrian treasury of folk tales and sayings is chock full of these "supernatural" (?) encounters, which used to scare people out of their minds!

Sil's crazy out of-the-box thought: What if these "extradimensionals"/"demons" don't need to come after us out in the real world (like in a dark forest in a full moon night) anymore, but now we all have portals to their realm right in our own houses, in the form of TVs, scrying mirriors AKA smartphones, etc., by which we humans can be manipulated in more subtle ways...

That's it guys - Roll the X-Files theme!! :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
Post automatically merged:

Yeah, I think we can actually put this fact in the books. We need a book.
OH YES ABSOLUTELY we need a book! :D
But published as a collab, published under some bombastic pseudonym, just like the Renaissance guys did, so no single on of us can take the credit for all of it, IMHO! I would volunteer to do the German version, as I have experience with book writing haha. But let's hold our horses and take our time with that I would say, unless the end of the world is really coming in 2012. What...? Oh. It's almost 2019 already. What happened!? :ROFLMAO::LOL::ROFLMAO:
 
Last edited:

Paracelsus

Well-known member
Messages
163
Likes
601
#18
The Wild Hunt - in the New World.


In America, we gained a New World, a world full of wild woods, things we never bothered to ask the "Native Americans" about. This is our version of The Wild Hunt - "The Wendigo" - thought to both be the Ojibwe, Algonquin, and even Tsalagi (Cherokee) taboo against cannabalism. Yet, it was a real being too, absolutely terrifying in visage. It is described as a 7 to 9 feet tall severely-emaciated/corpse-like human being with pale rotting skin stretched tightly over long spindly limbs with long black claws. It's head appears as either a rotting human's or stag's head full of razor sharp gnarled teeth and bloody lips with glowing yellow eyes. In the Ojibwe legends you can hear the Wendigo approaching by the sound of frantic disincarnate drumming.
-
Of course in America the Sasquatch is well known, but, there is more to the story. Amongst the Northern and Pacific Coast tribes there is the more benign "Hairy Old Man of the Forest," and the evil "Hairy Man of the Forest." The tribes such as the Blackfoot, Crow, and Cree make dire warnings to their tribe about the woods. Some woods have good medicine others are bad medicine, stepping foot into these woods means you might not step out again.

Chalk this all up to silly Indian superstition, but, as David Paulides reasearch is clearly showing, people are going missing. They are going missing now, and they've been going missing for a long time. Sometimes they're found, other times there is no earthly trace of them whatsoever.

Sadly, I don't have any firsthand Cherokee stories from my Grandpa, he struggled with alcoholism most of his life and died before I was born. Even my mom has only bits and pieces of his story, but she does know that he was born on a reservation.
 

nothingnew

Active member
Messages
31
Likes
122
#19
@Silvanus777, please do not refrain from posting German videos as well. I'm probably not the only German speaking member here.


The fact that Europe was mostly spared whereas almost everyone else got obliterated does seem very strange to me. No way it was by pure chance or luck. Could this instead point in the direction where these attacks are originating from? Also, we seem to agree that most of these catastrophes happened after the year 1000, mind you after the crusades.


They later went on with WW1 and WW2 to destroy what was left of the old remnants that were still standing proudly throughout Europe.


Bear in mind, I have nothing against the Swiss people. Do you guys recognize this?

23032505_903090909839635_3002252713968934241_n.jpg


Nooo it cant be, right? These people have the technology and they proved throughout history what they are truly capable of.


While we are on Ancient Tales, how about Schneewittchen/Snow White?



If you want some insight, look into Sean Hross. Here are his yt channels:
chatzefratz
giureh
Central Intelligence Agency


If you can stand the prominent swearing and some occasionally very shaky handheld camera footage, you are in for a treat I guarantee. A good start would be Die Pharaonen Show/The Pharaohs Show, both in German and English. There are some videos in French as well there, if that rocks your boat.
 

BStankman

Well-known member
Messages
377
Likes
1,503
#20
@Silvanus777,

If you want some insight, look into Sean Hross. Here are his yt channels:
chatzefratz
giureh
Central Intelligence Agency


If you can stand the prominent swearing and some occasionally very shaky handheld camera footage, you are in for a treat I guarantee. A good start would be Die Pharaonen Show/The Pharaohs Show, both in German and English. There are some videos in French as well there, if that rocks your boat.
Yes it is all Swissie!
They never fight, but the army is prepared for the victory celebration.

corkscrew.jpg

"Damn Pharaohs!"
 
Top